Pride in Our City – The Podcast, Episode 3

Posted: 2nd June 2021

Episode 3 of Pride in Our City – The Podcast is here!
Pride in Our City – The Podcast brings you a series of introductions and conversations between Podcast host Dan Vo (Dan’s Twitter) and members of the Pride in Our City project team. Throughout the series Dan will be chatting with project curators, artists and community members about their involvement in Pride in Our City, and what it means to them to be involved. We’ll be taking you behind the scenes of the project as it takes shape, and revealing some exciting updates about our upcoming exhibition.

The third episode features Jamie Walmsley who is a proud co-founder, and player for the Roundheads (Hull Roundhead’s Twitter), an inclusive rugby team based in Hull. Jamie has also been involved in the Pride in Our City project in a number of ways, and contributed to some amazing video discussions for our digital exhibition back in 2020. In this episode of the podcast you’ll hear Jamie explain how the Roundheads team came about, why inclusive sport is so important to him and to communities in Hull, and how projects such as Pride in Our City can play a part in improving representation and inclusivity. Plus (spoiler alert), you’ll also hear Dan and Jamie’s wonderful rendition of I Want to Break Free…

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You can listen to all three episodes of Pride in Our City – the Podcast here:
Episode 3 – Click Here
Or on YouTube: Click Here

About the Roundheads
The Hull Roundheads is Hull’s first male inclusive rugby team and was founded in Hull in August 2018 on the basis of joining a global community of Inclusive Rugby where men of any gender, sexuality or race can come together for the love of the sport. It doesn’t matter if you’re gay, bi, straight or trans, The Hull Roundheads is a family with one purpose, to play rugby and to have fun playing! They welcome any guys age 18+ to give rugby a try in a safe and welcoming environment.
You can find out more about the Roundheads on their website here – www.roundheadsrufc.co.uk
You can also find them on social media via the following:
Hull Roundhead’s Facebook
Hull Roundhead’s Twitter
Hull Roundhead’s Instagram

About Pride in Our City
The Pride in Our City project aims to increase LGBTQ+ representation and inclusion throughout Hull Museums’ research, interpretation, and programming. It is an ongoing project that prioritises co-curation with communities and new understanding of untold narratives.

Now, a focus group of local community advisors and a Lead Creative Artist are working with the Hull Museums team on the next steps of this project, to develop a community-led exhibition, showcasing Hull’s LGBTQ+ history at the Ferens Art Gallery.

Explore the Pride in Our City digital exhibition here: Click Here

Want to keep updated on the Pride in Our City project? Why not sign up to our project mailing list to have updates sent straight to your inbox. Find out more and sign up here: Click Here

Episode Transcript
Download a copy of the episode transcript here: Click here to download

Dan: I want to break free!

Jamie: I want to break free!

Dan: I want to break free from your lies…

Jamie: You’re so self-satisfied I don’t need you!

Together: I’ve got to break free! God knows, God knows I want to break free!

Dan: Yay, that’s going at the top of the podcast now.

Jamie: Oh no!

Dan: Hello everyone, welcome to the Hull Museums podcast, I’m Dan Vo and I’m your host. Now if you’re wondering what that was at the top of the podcast, well just you wait, we will get to it. It is episode 3 and as you know we talk to amazing local guests who are involved with the Pride in Our City exhibition, the exhibition that’s coming to the Ferens Art Gallery, it’s so close to being ready and we just can’t wait to have you in so you can see the amazing work that has been put into this exhibition with our artist-led, community-created extravaganza! Now in previous episode we’ve heard all about the Roundheads, they are the inclusive sports team where men of any gender, sexuality or race come to play rugby. So that means that if you’re gay, bi, straight, trans, you are welcome.

We’re going to speak to one of the Roundheads today, but before we do, I’ve actually got a nice history nugget to share with you. Now who doesn’t love history, it is a museum podcast after all! So, you’ll like this, there’s history in the name the Roundheads. It’s a nod to Hull history as well. Hull was where Oliver Cromwell launched his successful campaign to take the North and win the English Civil War. So, the Parliament soldiers who served under him were called Roundheads because of the round shape of their helmets, and that’s where the team gets their name from. And you can actually see it on their crest, the rainbow crest that’s on their shirt as well, there’s a nice round head, a helmet on their crest, but between you and me it looks more like an oval head because also cleverly it’s in the shape of a rugby ball as well. They’re so clever these lads! Now today I’m actually going to speak with Jamie Walmsley who is one of the co-founders of the Roundheads. He’s s a transgender man who thinks that playing for Roundheads is a dream come true and he’s so, so proud of being on a team where he’s just another one of the blokes, playing the sport he loves, with a massive rainbow emblazoned across his shirt. So, hello Jamie.

Jamie: Hi, I’m Jamie Wamsley and I play for the Hull Roundheads. I’ve played for them since the team started, which I think is coming up for possibly two years, maybe even three years now. Scary long time!

Dan: And what do you do with the Roundheads?

Jamie: I’m a player. So, I play in the forwards, normally a prop.

Dan: But Jamie, I’ve got to confess. I have no idea what that means. What does it mean to be a prop?

Jamie: Okay, a prop! So, that’s in the scrum, which is the nice big huggy bit. So, it’s just kind of in the front row in the scrum.

Dan: So, is that a particularly coveted place to be in or is it, you know, the toughest place to be in or something like that?

Jamie: I guess it depends what you want from it. I mean, really only position the forwards, which is more or less the ones that are in the scrum, you’re the people that are going to be smashing into people, get into all the contact and the tackles and all those kind of bits. So, if you like that, then it’s good. That tends to be where the chunky people go. Whereas the quick people are at the backs and they’re the ones that are running around everywhere, which yeah, I could not do what they do. So…

Dan: We’ve heard so much about the Roundheads on the podcast already. You are a very special group within the local community. You’ve got a very special place within Hull.

Jamie: It is lovely to play in a team where we can celebrate our sexualities, celebrate our differences and our different backgrounds. I think, sometimes people get a bit shy when they join a sports team that they have to fit in with what they think they have to be, which I think really, if you probably all stopped and chatted to each other about your backgrounds, it won’t be as scary as you expected, but it’s nice to kind of join in with something, right from the get go, you know, you can talk about pride, you can talk about, you know, sexuality who you fancy or all that kind of thing. It’s a really nice, comfortable environment.

I’ve always enjoyed playing rugby. I played rugby briefly when I was younger, kind of just as I was leaving primary school. And like, I’m a transgender man… At the time, I was still having to play in girl’s teams, and when I was a kid, it was kind of pre medical transition and stuff. So, I played for… First I played for a mixed team when I was 10 and then I had to move into the girl’s team when I was about 12, which I didn’t want to have to do, because then it was not playing a team with guys anymore, and I had to be kind of obviously a girl. And at that point, I mean, I had my hair shaved off and I was dressing like a guy, but I did, you know, as puberty kicked in it was kind of obvious I wasn’t one of the boys. And really I played until I was about 15 / 16, and then, yeah, I just, it got uncomfortable. You know, I was, I was playing in teams of women and I stuck out like a sore thumb and it just wasn’t the right fit for me. And the team were lovely and so supportive and, yeah, my coach was amazing. She used to stick up for me all the time. Because sometimes other coaches or other people would say, you know, what are you doing with a lad on your team and she’d explain. And some of them were better than others and it was quite a few years ago, I’m sure it’ll be different now, but it kinda got difficult, so I just kind of backed out.

And then, when I left that and when I started university, I thought this might be the time when I can pick up a sport again. But then at that point I was told, oh, well, really you can only do mixed sports. Because at that time I was just about to start testosterone and, like, the medical transition process and they said really you’re probably best just doing the mixed things, which there was, I think, ten pin bowling, darts and swimming. And I just thought, oh, I don’t know if any of those are right for me. I tried swimming and it just wasn’t quite right at the time and then I just thought, well, maybe that’s it for sports, maybe I just need to go to the gym in a couple years and do that. And when I found out about the Roundheads where I could just go play and it was celebrated and you know, you didn’t have to think, oh, you know, am I going to be the one that’s different? You were just there and accepted. And it’s really lovely and it’s been totally, just kind of… I think so many people have kind of come from places where they think, oh, can I do this? Can I do that? And they’ve come and joined in and said, oh, thank God for this. It’s brilliant. And you know, we travel, play matches, meet loads of people and you know, we’re a proper rugby team. We don’t just pretend. So it’s really nice.

Dan: So, tell me what it was like then to, to come across to the Roundheads? How did you first find them? And then what was it like when you first stepped into… stepped into the… I want to call it arena, it’s not arena, but stepped into the pitch! Stepped into the pitch.

Jamie: Yeah, so I mean, where I grew up, I didn’t grow up very far away from Hull, I’m just over the other side of the Humber Bridge, which is only five or so miles away. But I was in a little village, kind of like the Vicar of Dibley, very quiet. Small community. And I always, you know… if I could get across to Hull, it was great because it was a city, there was loads of things to do, places to go, loads of different people. So it was always Hull I’d go to for a bit of a life. And I thought, you know, one day it would really be nice to live here instead.

And then I’d already lived in Hull for a couple of years, and it was just on a friend’s Facebook status. I think they just said, “Oh thinking of starting a gay rugby team. Is there anyone that’s interested?” and I had kind of heard things about a team in Manchester, and I suppose that it didn’t really click until I saw that Facebook status talk about Hull. And I kind of looked up about the Manchester Spartans a bit more, which is the Manchester team, and found out a bit more about them and what kind of to expect with gay rugby. If, you know, something started in Hull, and I think the first meeting where I think there were 15 or so of us that all got together and sat around the table and just discussed it, and how to get started, and what different roles people might have in getting it started. And then, at the Leeds Hunters they helped us a lot in getting started as well, and just directed us what to do, and how to arrange coaches, and venues, and all that kind of thing. And then that first time I remember for the first training session thinking oh God, you know, what to expect and who to expect there, would there be anyone I know or anything like that? And I’m wondering how many people there would be, especially I thought, kind of, am I going to get there, and they’d be like two of us! But, you know, it got there and there were at least 20 of us, even just at that first session, which was just amazing. And we’re at the university as well, and like their grounds and facilities and stuff are brilliant. So, you’re there on a proper pitch. And there was loads of people there and we were all so excited and it was just amazing, just straight away it was like, oh, this is going to be really special, because just there’s been nothing like it. And we’re all there just having a laugh, having fun. And it was just a really nice way as well of, of meeting different people. I think, I mean, I find this, you know, as a gay or a trans person in terms of trying to meet someone that’s like me, sometimes it’s difficult. Like I think, oh, well have I got to use an app, or have I got to go drinking somewhere to, you know, to meet someone similar. Whereas to go play a sport is something different. And to me, something that’s, you know, healthy, productive, and, you know, gets you out a bit and just so much fun.

Dan: I suppose with being on a sports team as well, you’ve described yourself as the prop, you fit into a particular place. You become part of the team and you support each other in a way that is different to when you’re just kind of going out and meeting people. There is a role and responsibility for you here.

Jamie: Yeah, definitely that. You definitely kind of find your place, I guess at first, when you’re training and think, oh, where will I fit in? And, you know, sometimes nerves kick in before matches and things. But I remember like our first match, that was the time when for me it kind of really kind of cemented in thinking, yep, this is so right. Because you know, you have your position that you know you’re going to play and you’ve trained and practiced for so long and then it’s that moment of walking out onto the pitch, and that to me is always the really special bit, the walk out of the change rooms. Because I’m always really nervous and I overthink everything and like in the change room beforehand, I just get really nervous and quiet and sit in a corner and then go out on the pitch and just… It’s that thing as well… I could play rugby for another team and it would be great and I would enjoy it. And I’m much more confident than I ever was when I was younger and stuff. But I think now being part of an inclusive team and a team that’s proud of being gay and being different and having allies and, you know, talking about sexuality and being different. I think I just feel so proud when I come out on the pitch and then we go get started and it was great. And it’s just so much fun, really, really special. And yeah, when you get the hang of playing matches and stuff, and like you say, you know your place, you know your position and how you support each other. And I know like in the forwards, I mean, we talk about pods. So a lot of the stuff in the matches we’ll have little groups that will form, to like support each other and protect each other. And like in the scrum, you get to know the people around you supporting you. And like, I love all that kind of togetherness. It’s really nice.

Dan: I rather like that word, togetherness. And when you go onto the pitch, now, if I was going to ask you to describe it in one word, how would you describe that word as you run out onto the pitch?

Jamie: Oh, it definitely would be proud, just so much pride. I mean, I’ve got to say quite nervous as well, because you know, we’re playing full contact rugby and sometimes we’ll walk out and we’ll laugh about it. Because we’ll walk out and be like, yeah, you know, we’re really ready, and then we see the other team come on and they’re all huge and think okay! Is this going to be okay? But you know, we always have a great time and we are always very competitive in all the matches. So we, you know, we’re trying really hard. Everyone gets a bit stressed and really goes for it and stuff. But then literally as soon as the match ends, we’re there hugging the other team, and we always have social evenings and stuff afterwards with them, go drinking and have a party and stuff and chat in the bar.

It’s always, really, a really nice atmosphere. We’re yet to come across another team, especially the inclusive teams that have kind of fobbed us off. It’s always a chance to kind of, you know, meet people from different places. And, you know, when you go into away matches and you know, we get to travel around the UK and, you know, playing rugby and it’s so much fun and, and there’s even chances to go abroad and play in different tournaments. So the chances to go abroad and be representing Hull, and be, you know, talking about LGBT and inclusivity. It’s just fantastic.

Dan: I’ve got to pick up on the idea that you planted, which was that you came from a town which is not too far removed from the Vicar of Dibley.

Jamie: Yeah.

Dan: I suppose the idea of there is that in a village like that, it is dependent on say the Vicar, you know, Dawn French as the Vicar, being the person who champions change, being the person who kind of says, no, this is the way we should be thinking about the way that the village is open and welcoming. And it sounds like your coach was certainly someone who played that role, you know, standing up for you, but also kind of getting everyone to realise that this is what we should doing, we should be inclusive, we should be welcoming, we should be, you know, being good sports people and give everybody a fair go.

Jamie: Yeah, definitely. I think, especially at the moment in the last few months has been a lot of talk about transgender people and whether they should be playing rugby or not, is it, you know, is it safe for them to play rugby? And I could understand why people would worry about joining a team and having to tell a coach, you know, being trans isn’t something that just slips into conversation. You’ve got to, you’ve got to tell somebody and, you know, should you tell somebody that’s another argument as well. But I think, you know, to give people credit. I think most people, you know, if you talk to them openly and honestly, I think most people just might, you know, they might not have the information right then and there to help, but they’ll do their best to accommodate for you to get that information. Because if you’re passionate about the sport and you want to do it, that’s why they’re there, that’s why they give up their weekends to train people and take people to matches and stuff. And I personally, I’ve had good experience with other teams that I’ve joined that haven’t been inclusive teams because, yeah, I’ve spoken to that person and, and kind of, I suppose, opened up kind of early on and said, I just need a bit of help and you know, is everything gonna be okay? And can I trust that you’ve got my back and people have always been brilliant. You know, I can understand why people get nervous about it. Because it’s a difficult conversation to have with someone.

I suppose I always have that drive of, I don’t want it to take over my life. I don’t want to end up where I just shut myself away and don’t do anything. Because then for me, like, I mean, I absolutely had to transition. Like I couldn’t have, I couldn’t have just got through life as female. Like it would not have worked for me at all. But going through all the kind of the medical transition and then socially, like all the difficult situations you come across as you’re growing up and change and, and transitioned, and it’s kind of like, you know, if I don’t go live my life, what have I done it for, you know, I could have just stayed in forever and not interacted with anybody and been upset rather than gone and tried to get at life a bit and think it’s kind of looking after yourself to make sure you do have them conversations. And I think as well, I mean, if you start in a new team or starting something new, when you think, you know, I really should tell that person whether it’s because of, you know, health or support or whatever it is, if they come back to you and they’re not very nice, or they’re not supportive, you know, obviously that’s horrible, but I think, you know, then they’re not worth your effort. They’re not worth your time. Leave that behind, there’ll be another group, there’ll be another coach, there’ll be another person and another opportunity that you can go join in with, like just don’t give up. Because, I’ve had, you know, bad doctors in the past. I’ve had a lot of doctors that fobbed me off about my transition. And I just kept trying, and trying, and trying because I absolutely had to do it. And the same with sport, I suppose, like I just thought, you know, I really love to do sport, I’d love to play a sport and I’ve done things like gyms where it doesn’t matter, it’s just me on my own, but I didn’t want to give it up completely. And finding the Roundheads was like, oh fantastic, you know, I’ve done it now. And I’m settled and happy, and this is brilliant. And it’s just, it’s just, you know, finding the right people, finding the right activity in the right things.

Dan: Jamie do you feel that you’re in a position of responsibility for the rest of the team as well? You’ve got to look after the other ones that come in and are part of your inclusive team, but you’ve got to make sure that they’re, they are safe… In you having these conversations, it’s providing them with a safe space to kind of, just play as well.

Jamie: Yeah, definitely. I mean, I try and always think of when I first joined and being nervous and all the things that I worried about. And I want people to love it as much as I love it and to get as much from it as I get from it. So yeah, when there’s new people, I always try and be a bit of a mum and kind of look after, and make sure they’re happy, and you know, not like asking them loads of questions, but, you know, bring things up a little bit, you know, talk about… I don’t know, like bring up about sexuality or bring up about different things that you kind of, that maybe you wouldn’t if you were just going and joining your average team, just to let them know that it’s, it’s comfortable, you know, we can talk about stuff. And I think as well, like as a team we, you know, we kind of, we have responsibility to the community and to other LGBT people, because I think we’re something different. Having, you know, having an inclusive sports team is so different. People are used to, like, a nightlife and bars and things like that, and places to go. But, you know, we’re in a different kind of thing. And I think we’ve just got to do our best to, to show that we’re, you know, we’re a part of the community and, you know, connect it with other services, other people. And hopefully when people join, they’re not just joining an inclusive rugby team, they’re also joining an inclusive rugby team that’s got connections with all these other services and other people and organisations. And they’ve kind of, yeah, I just imagined like if some wanted moved to Hull maybe with university or whatever, and if they’re a bit shy and they thought, oh, well, I’ll join this and, you know, just in case that hopefully we’re giving them links to loads of things. It’s not just you becoming this, you know, a member of this rugby team, which is great, but you’re also, you’ve joined in this whole community of people, whether that be, you know, with our sponsors, you know, a lot of my sponsors are venues and, you know, safe spaces for us to go, or whether we’re pointing people to like different services in Hull, like we’ve got a lot of really good like mental health services and support groups and things as well. So it’s kind of welcoming people to all that kind of stuff.

Dan: Jamie can we talk a little bit about the relationship then between the Roundheads and also Hull Museums and why you think that this is a really important step as well, in terms of that community aspect, in terms of engaging with the community as well?

Jamie: Yeah. So I think like for any organisation, like say, you know, for the Roundheads, it’s important for us to be in touch with other organisations, let people know that we’re there and what we do and what we’re about, and that we’re not just some secret little group that no one can get hold of. And a couple of years ago, we did a project with Hull Museums where we put together a video of different clips of people talking about Pride and, and that was fantastic. And, you know, getting people’s names, faces out there and, you know, that we were a rugby team talking about Pride. I mean, I still think even though there’s 20 or 30 odd teams in the UK, it’s still different to see a rugby player talking about Pride, and Pride in their community. And it being someone close by to you, I think for people in Hull to see that and go, oh, well, that’s different, that’s exciting. I think that’s great. And, and having something in the gallery where loads and loads of people every day, you’re going to be seeing that and, and they’ll be seen by our team and there’ll be, there’ll be looking at, you know, rainbows and Pride and being different and, and like imagining like little kids seeing that, kids at school and thinking, oh yeah, it’s okay for me to be different. Or, you know, older people that have maybe felt a bit kind of lost or alone and, you know, just showing there’s them communities out there. There’s them people that are ready to, you know, to talk to you and be supportive, you know, friends. Every, you know, everything.

Dan: So, Jamie, I understand that the Roundheads have had a discussion with Matthew Sedman who’s the new artist in residence for the Pride in Our City project. And the Roundheads have had a discussion around some of the things that you’d like to see in this upcoming exhibition. So, what were some of the things you talked about?

Jamie: Yeah. So, we did have a look at some other similar exhibitions that have been around the country that were really fascinating and just amazing. And we want to talk about some themes that were really important to us as a team and messages that we really wanted to get out there. So, you know, we talked about, kind of, everybody is a rugby body, which we throw out as a quote all the time. Just trying to say, you know, whether you’re big, small, short, tall trans, gay, whatever, you know, you’re welcome at rugby. Everyone can get involved. We also were talking about kind of spaces that we thought could kind of evoke other ideas and themes and things. And we talked about like a locker room kind of theme, because, you know, a lot of, a lot of stuff goes on around the locker room. It’s where we go before, after matches. We’re all chatting as a team and egging each other on and saying, you know, we’re going to do it and talk about tactics, and we have a bit of a team talk before we go out and stuff, and kind of get each other riled up before we go. And then when we get back in, we love putting a speaker on getting some RuPaul on and kind of dancing around the change room, especially if we’ve won. So yeah, it’s good.

Dan: And, and that’s definitely the whole point. That must therefore be the most safe space. So that’s where everybody has to feel incredibly safe, to be able to, to feel those emotions in order to, you know, just let loose and be able to be whatever they want to be in that space.

Jamie: Yeah, definitely. Yeah.

Dan: And I want to kind of get an understanding from you in terms of, you know, why inclusive sports, and then on the bigger picture, why an inclusive museum would be important as well?

Jamie: Starting with inclusive sports, you know, sometimes people worry, oh, you know, I’ve got to be a certain thing to go enjoy a sport. Whether it’s, I’ve got to go be big and strong or, you know, depending on what the sport is, they feel like they have to fit in a certain box. And with inclusive rugby, you don’t, it’s just about enjoying sport and wanting to be part of a team and, you know, being there to support your team members and, you know, we’re all very different. We all have different backgrounds, look different, sound different, are different, but we all come together, play rugby and you’re meeting friends for life. I think playing inclusive sports and you can be your total authentic self and meet similar people. It’s really good.

And, and like, and saying about the museums, I think just to show that the museums are supportive and that they’re passionate about inclusivity and, and, you know, that everyone’s welcome. And, you know, even if it’s a little thing sometimes with, you know, whether, whether it’s like a football stadium, putting a rainbow flag up, you know, if that’s something that makes a few more people feel welcome and safe, you know, that’s fantastic. That’s such a small gesture, like putting a rainbow flag up, but it really does help people and, and just discussing sexuality and gender, wherever that might be, I think the more positive conversations that happen, people hear those and that, you know, that’ll mean hopefully over time, you know, more and more people understand, because I think a lot of the roots of kind of the bad conversations and the bad things you hear is when people just don’t understand, or they haven’t met anybody that’s gay, or they haven’t met anybody that’s different. And you know, when they hear someone’s story, it can make a big difference.

But it would be so special to go in and see things that are LGBT or see things that the roundheads and over organisations or the people in Hull that I know of have contributed, that’s really special. And, and to think of that, you know, we can talk about that in years to come. We can say, you know, once upon a time we were in a museum or we were in an art gallery, that is fantastic and really special.

Dan: Now Jamie each episode I like to share a different clip from the person that I’m speaking with. And we’ve actually got one today from the Roundheads’ YouTube where you’ve got an amazing clip where you’re showing incredible team spirit here, because everybody sort of dresses up, and everybody takes part in something rather remarkable, there’s a little bit of a karaoke going on with the Roundheads, so I’m going to expect that you’re going to sing a little for us now, are you… have you got your microphone ready?

Jamie: Always!

Dan: Describe me your karaoke microphone, I imagining it’s gold and diamante studded?

Jamie: Of course, definitely. Um, that’d be my, my dream one. Um, mine’s just an invisible one. Make it work! Whatever’s around!

Dan: An air microphone. How are you at the lyrics then? Can you sing it for me now?

Jamie: Oh, um, normally I just lip sync it. I shouldn’t have to sing! Are you talking about the, uh, video?

Dan: Oh, yes, that’s right. Yep.

Jamie: Yeah. Oh, that was a great one. I mean, as well, because we’ve done a few little music videos and things now. And for me, the favourite bit is seeing the finished product because we don’t share with each other what each of us look like, and you know, how, how we’ve gone to town with some of the costumes and some of the guys really go for it. It’s always so funny. And we used to have like little viewing evenings where we’d all get together on Zoom and someone would play the video, we all would watch it for the first time and just be laughing our heads off at each other, but the I Want to Break Free video is fantastic. There’s some great costumes, some great makeup on there, some wigs, it’s brilliant.

Dan: Do you think there’s a case to be made for this being included in the archive of Hull Museums?

Jamie: Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, it’s definitely something different!

I mean, because some of the guys, I mean, they have proper, their own drag wardrobe of, you know, dresses and things just ready for things like this. Whereas I don’t really, I think I’ve got maybe a cheerleader costume from a few years ago (Halloween) and a few wigs that my mom gave me, just for dressing up. And I think I’ve got a pink bob in the video and like I’m bald normally. So it was a big change. I tried my best at makeup. Like, I raided Poundland and did my best. Uh, but yeah, it was really fun. Some of the guys, I mean, they, they did the proper Freddie Mercury for the video. Got like, got like pretty much all the costume bang on, there’s some interesting mustaches in the video. It’s really good.

Dan: Are you going to, you’re going to give us a few lines now?

Jamie: I’m… I’m still just a little bit shy. I mean, I don’t know how I feel about this going down in history, me trying to sing to Queen!

Dan: What if I went first and you did the follow up with lyric? I want to break free!

Jamie: I want to break free!

Dan: I want to break free from your lies…

Jamie: You’re so self-satisfied I don’t need you!

Together: I’ve got to break free! God knows, God knows I want to break free!

Dan: Yay, that’s going at the top of the podcast now.

Jamie: Oh no!

Dan: Well, I think this is the thing, right? Inclusivity can be fun. Being inclusive is fun!

Jamie: Oh, definitely. That’s the best bet!

Dan: So Jamie, if people want to get in touch, if they want to play for the Roundheads, if they want to see what the Roundheads is doing with Hull Museums for this wonderful exhibition Pride in Our City, how should they get in touch with you?

Jamie: So, we’re on social media. So if you search for Hull Roundheads, you’ll find us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and we also have a website. So that’s roundheadsrufc.co.uk.

Dan: I’m going to give you space now just for a final thought that if you want to give everybody a takeaway…

Jamie: Oh, I think don’t be afraid of anything. Don’t think that you can’t, you know, go play a sport, go join a group, go do something for any reason. If you want to go do it, there’ll always be a way. And if you meet bad people on the way, they’re not worth it, move on to the next one, because there will always be an opportunity for you.

Dan: Jamie, it has been such a treat speaking with you.

Jamie: Well, thank you so much. I’ve really enjoyed it.

Dan: And thank you for karaoke.

Jamie: Yeah. We’ll get you back for that.

Dan: Well, this has been the Pride in Our City podcast for Hull Museums you can find us on social media on Twitter as @Hull_Museums. I’ve been Dan Vo, you can find me as @DanNouveau. This podcast was produced by me and edited by Samuel Gunn.

If you liked what you heard, please do rate, review, and subscribe, get involved, tell everybody how much you love us. There are still quite a few chats coming up, so please do spread the word. And if you want to get involved go to the Pride in Our City website, it’s on Hull Museums and just do a search for the words Pride in Our City, where you’ll find lots of blogs and videos and you can also sign up to the mailing list. So just go to HumberMuseums.com and look for Pride in Our City. Well that’s it for today, thank you so much and it’s been a delight having you. So I’ll see you again soon. Bye!